6 thoughts on “The Whole Kit And Kaboodle Moe mechanics DTL”
P SMITH says:
Hi JH – Fascinating stuff on the evolution of your Moe hybrid swing. I
can’t help but see similarities between Moe’s swing and the technique that
Tom Tomasello advocated for a ‘right arm’ swinging technique. One of the
main differences is the width of the stance, because Tom said that a narrow
stance allowed freedom to move through post impact and allow the head to
move over. The ‘butting’ move was more akin to throwing your upper right
arm and both forearms ‘down and out’ on the swing plane (just like a karate
chop). This move was done at the start of the downswing to increase the
speed of the clubhead and then let gravity take hold to accelerate the
clubhead even more by passive release of the wrists but still feel that
push of the right hand to keep up with the left hand/arm through impact
(ie. to help with that late hit). The other big difference is that sit down
move into the left buttock which I can’t do because it sort of locks my
front hip (fully internally rotated) and delays me trying to get it ‘out of
the way’ in the downswing. Imho, I agree with you that not many people can
do that lateral slide that Moe did . When looking DTL at how Moe finished
in the follow-through it looks quite a difficult move to suddenly stop the
swing progressing on that ‘single’ plane and then bringing it up more
vertically into the finish. For me personally , a ‘reactive pivot’ using
the throwing of the forearms ‘down and out’ while my hips are still turned
(or closed ) suits me better than an ‘active’ sit down/pivot move. Whenever
I try to do an active hip move , it turns my shoulder immediately because I
don’t have the hula-hula flexibility in the spine between my hips and
shoulders.
1atomicgolf says:
Hi Keith,
Its definately horses for courses relative to how individuals can apply any
of the Moe mechanics, I personally do not have the hip extensor flexibility
I need to get s laterally forward enough and stay down in the shot as much
as I would like to.
I think a lot of the problems people have generally with Moe’s swing is the
perception of his through swing, you yourself see it going from a circular
motion to the ball then moving lineally through the ball and ‘Up’ to the
finish, Moe swung the club in a semi circle like every other player, he had
forearm rotation like every other player, in fact post impact if yo look
from above his swing his arms were going left just as aggressively as any
other player with a conventional swing type.
I think the perception of thinking that the club goes down the line after
impact kills most players chances of using Moe’s swing type, http://www.kuykendallgolf.com/members/MemberFiles/31-637.pdf…this page of
pictures if you scroll down to near the bottom you will see how much Moe
rotates his foreams through the ball which is indicative of the club head
moving in a semi circle ‘around’ his body on nthe follow throgh, he pulls
the club back from its semi circle finish position to an uprioght plane
position at the finish of his swing which visually confuses everyone.
As well if you look at the impact pictures of Moe even at the age he was in
the pictures he had incredible hip extensor flexibility and lower back
muscle flexibility, to keep his head over his right knee and get as much
lateral side bend as he did is individual specific clearly.
I would love to increase me side bend flexibility to get where he gets at
impact, I am actually working on some machines at the Gym to get an
increase in hip extensor flexibility and lower back flexibility, if I can
get an empty Gym I will do some video on the exercises.
cheers JH
P SMITH says:
Played extremely well today using that ‘karate chop’ feeling with a hinged
right hand. Was close to hitting 78 but poor decision making rather than
any loose strikes cost me two 8’s on a par 5 and par 4 hole (finished with
an 84). It was probably the most effortless game of golf I’ve ever played
and I distinctly felt a successful Moe type 6 iron swing on a 162 yd par 3
where I finished just like you (completely in balance with front knee bent)
– felt great but I didn’t know how I did it – it just happened. Weird.
1atomicgolf says:
Hi Keith,
The real secret of the Golf Swing is just knowing absolutely what you did
when you hit the ball as you want to, I think Hogan and Moe Norman truly
knew how their swings worked, and Nicklaus did as well.
Its tough at the amateur club player level to have the time resources to
practice with the commitment and investigation to be able to work out how
the swing operates precisely when you do hit the good shot, translating the
‘feel’ of a good shot into the actual applied mechanics of the shot is as I
said earlier the true ‘Secret’.
Having said all that you have ‘felt’ what the swing ‘can’ do so its worth
the effort tracking down the true ’cause’ of the good shot.
cheers JH
Thomas Slagle says:
This is the most “Moeish” I’ve seen you swing. It almost looks like the
left shoulder remains higher than the right all the way to the top. Do you
have that sensation?
1atomicgolf says:
Hi Thomas’
The left shoulder up is a result of trying to keep the shoulders closed at
impact, as well the external rotation of the right humerus and the palm
‘up’ of the right hand during that rotation keeps the right shoulder back
and down which elevates the left shoulder as a consequence.
cheers JH
Hi JH – Fascinating stuff on the evolution of your Moe hybrid swing. I
can’t help but see similarities between Moe’s swing and the technique that
Tom Tomasello advocated for a ‘right arm’ swinging technique. One of the
main differences is the width of the stance, because Tom said that a narrow
stance allowed freedom to move through post impact and allow the head to
move over. The ‘butting’ move was more akin to throwing your upper right
arm and both forearms ‘down and out’ on the swing plane (just like a karate
chop). This move was done at the start of the downswing to increase the
speed of the clubhead and then let gravity take hold to accelerate the
clubhead even more by passive release of the wrists but still feel that
push of the right hand to keep up with the left hand/arm through impact
(ie. to help with that late hit). The other big difference is that sit down
move into the left buttock which I can’t do because it sort of locks my
front hip (fully internally rotated) and delays me trying to get it ‘out of
the way’ in the downswing. Imho, I agree with you that not many people can
do that lateral slide that Moe did . When looking DTL at how Moe finished
in the follow-through it looks quite a difficult move to suddenly stop the
swing progressing on that ‘single’ plane and then bringing it up more
vertically into the finish. For me personally , a ‘reactive pivot’ using
the throwing of the forearms ‘down and out’ while my hips are still turned
(or closed ) suits me better than an ‘active’ sit down/pivot move. Whenever
I try to do an active hip move , it turns my shoulder immediately because I
don’t have the hula-hula flexibility in the spine between my hips and
shoulders.
Hi Keith,
Its definately horses for courses relative to how individuals can apply any
of the Moe mechanics, I personally do not have the hip extensor flexibility
I need to get s laterally forward enough and stay down in the shot as much
as I would like to.
I think a lot of the problems people have generally with Moe’s swing is the
perception of his through swing, you yourself see it going from a circular
motion to the ball then moving lineally through the ball and ‘Up’ to the
finish, Moe swung the club in a semi circle like every other player, he had
forearm rotation like every other player, in fact post impact if yo look
from above his swing his arms were going left just as aggressively as any
other player with a conventional swing type.
I think the perception of thinking that the club goes down the line after
impact kills most players chances of using Moe’s swing type,
http://www.kuykendallgolf.com/members/MemberFiles/31-637.pdf…this page of
pictures if you scroll down to near the bottom you will see how much Moe
rotates his foreams through the ball which is indicative of the club head
moving in a semi circle ‘around’ his body on nthe follow throgh, he pulls
the club back from its semi circle finish position to an uprioght plane
position at the finish of his swing which visually confuses everyone.
As well if you look at the impact pictures of Moe even at the age he was in
the pictures he had incredible hip extensor flexibility and lower back
muscle flexibility, to keep his head over his right knee and get as much
lateral side bend as he did is individual specific clearly.
I would love to increase me side bend flexibility to get where he gets at
impact, I am actually working on some machines at the Gym to get an
increase in hip extensor flexibility and lower back flexibility, if I can
get an empty Gym I will do some video on the exercises.
cheers JH
Played extremely well today using that ‘karate chop’ feeling with a hinged
right hand. Was close to hitting 78 but poor decision making rather than
any loose strikes cost me two 8’s on a par 5 and par 4 hole (finished with
an 84). It was probably the most effortless game of golf I’ve ever played
and I distinctly felt a successful Moe type 6 iron swing on a 162 yd par 3
where I finished just like you (completely in balance with front knee bent)
– felt great but I didn’t know how I did it – it just happened. Weird.
Hi Keith,
The real secret of the Golf Swing is just knowing absolutely what you did
when you hit the ball as you want to, I think Hogan and Moe Norman truly
knew how their swings worked, and Nicklaus did as well.
Its tough at the amateur club player level to have the time resources to
practice with the commitment and investigation to be able to work out how
the swing operates precisely when you do hit the good shot, translating the
‘feel’ of a good shot into the actual applied mechanics of the shot is as I
said earlier the true ‘Secret’.
Having said all that you have ‘felt’ what the swing ‘can’ do so its worth
the effort tracking down the true ’cause’ of the good shot.
cheers JH
This is the most “Moeish” I’ve seen you swing. It almost looks like the
left shoulder remains higher than the right all the way to the top. Do you
have that sensation?
Hi Thomas’
The left shoulder up is a result of trying to keep the shoulders closed at
impact, as well the external rotation of the right humerus and the palm
‘up’ of the right hand during that rotation keeps the right shoulder back
and down which elevates the left shoulder as a consequence.
cheers JH