Posted by William on October 25, 2016 in Moe Norman
Hi JH I tried this at the range last weekend and hit 50 Balls. A few balls
flew extremely well and dead straight and long for me. I think I started
to get the right leg behind the lead leg as you describe.On Monday I was
struggling to walk. The inner thigh on the right leg into the groin hurt
like hell. Obviously I do not have the range of motion to do that move. Is
there some way to circumvent this move to alleviate the strain on that
inner thigh and still get a good result. I am 68 years oldRegardsTony
I have mentioned on occasions the requirement to have a fairly good range
of hip extensor flexibility and groin muscles, if you release the right
heel a bit but keep and just let it float laterally without rolling
outwards you still should get a good result from the swing and it will take
a lot of the stretch requirement out of the action.
I’ve REALLY been enjoying your new series on the recent “atomic” changes
you’ve found in Moe’s swing.
Yesterday, I was watching some video clips on Henrik Stenson and suddenly
realized that he has a very interesting move that he uses to start his
There is a type of squatting/sitting move followed immediately by a very
interesting move of his right leg. It looks to me like he is straightening
his right leg as his left knee folds in.
Anyway, I haven’t seen it in slow motion so as to able to dissect it more
thoroughly but it does appear that he is getting into a Moe-like move with
his right leg.
If you get a chance, take a look and tell us what you think.
No doubt that Stenson has found something that has allowed him to become an
amazing (if not Moe-like) ball striker.
Henrik has that little precursor move into his right side to make sure he
gets his weight shift programmed because he used to have a very pronounced
‘pickup’ of the club in his early days and because he is such an free Arm
swinger it was easy for him to just pick his arms up and not get enough
rotational weight shift on the back swing.
I think he has the most aggressive free arm swing I have ever seen from any
world class player, but if you get to aggressive with the arms on the
backswing as he does its very easy to not shift the weight into the trail
side as you need to to facilitate the amount of lead weight shift you need
on the forward swing to balance up the support of the super aggressive free
arm swing into the ball.
Hi JH, I’ve been a long time admirer and follower of Moe’s perfect
mechanics and have only recently discovered your videos, which I’m really
enjoying. I’ve read almost every book there is about Moe and would like
your opinion on the part in Greg Lavern’s book where he reveals Moe’s most
important secret move (also done by Hogan apparently) and that is the first
move on the downswing being a move TOWARDS the ball with the sternum.
I haven seen that reference by Greg Lavern, I haven’t read any of his stuff
because he labelled everyone but himself as ‘Knuckleheads’ if we had the
temerity to offer ‘any’ opinion on Moe’s swing mechanics, so I have no
opinion on anything that he says frankly.
I will however point out the Anatomic flaw in that statement if it was made
in that specific frame of reference.
If we deduce that at the finish of the back swing Moe has turned his
shoulders normally to his right and being constructed as all other Humans
are his sternum is located between his shoulders which are turned at right
angle to the ball line how can the sternum be the first body section to
move towards the ball , how do you get the lead shoulder out of the way for
the sternum to be the first responder to the downswing without the lead
shoulder moving before the sternum.
Anatomically its impossible for the sternum to move independently of the
shoulder girdle, ok its semantics but this is the problem with so much
instruction information, its ‘perception’ by the person making the claims,
even Moe clearly didn’t do things he thought he did in his swing.
If Lavern had said Moe had the ‘Feeling’ his sternum was the first thing
that moved to the ball on the downswing that could be accepted… but the
‘feeling’ of the sternum going to the ball could not have happened if the
shoulder girdle did not stay closed and the proximal part of the body being
the left shoulder had not initiated the oblique transverse diagonal move
back to the ball line.
The sternum at the top of the back swing is facing ‘away’ from the ball
line…if it is to be the ‘first. thing to move ‘towards ‘ the ball on the
downswing it must move itself past the left shoulder girdle without the
left shoulder girdle moving which is an anatomical impossibility, again not
wanting to be pedantic but you just cannot use that type of description and
expect it to have any acceptance level of credibility of understanding from
people like myself , or anyone for that matter that understands basic human
My own explanation would be that you could have the feeling that you were
moving your sternum in an oblique direction to the ball line with the
sternum maintaining its closed position inside the shoulder girdle, I would
never say to feel the sternum was the ‘firs’t thing to move towards the
ball because that conjures up the sternum as ‘turning’ towards the ball by
itself independently which clearly would be a disaster as it would conjure
up the feeling of an early opening of the sternum on the downswing which
you obviously wouldnt want in Moe’s swing.
If Moe had the problem of ‘perceptional’ swing process movements as apposed
to reality I can understand other people having the same problems,
‘thinking’ of the sternum as being the ‘first’ thing to move to the ball is
OK, but in reality it doesn’t and cannot happen .
Thanks for the reply, I didn’t like his manner either and quite frankly I
couldn’t understand what he meant and how to do it anyway. Do the think
Todd Graves’ method is more sound?
I think the Graves method is the best for players generally because what
they advocate is well explained and can be done reasonably easily , there
is not the ‘deep secrets’ of specific personal things that Moe supposedly
did, I can tell you stuff he said he did personally but they are way to
hard to do for the learner, or even the very good player because they are
relative to ‘Moe’s” capabilities and physicality.
The best way to go down the Moe mechanics road is to just apply the
‘essence’ of his swing mechanics and not the ‘personal specifics’…the
Graves method is very ‘learn-able’ , I think they are the best guys by far
to learn the overall process of Moe’s swing, at the end of the day getting
a swing that lets you cut out a lot of the rotation through the ball is
what Moe’s swing is really about, and that’s all I try to do myself .
Great Videos, Thank You for your effort. You are one of the fews that
understands the importance of cameras, angles and that delivers the message
better than others.
Hit about 600 balls yesterday of which 45 straight, realized just now that
the right arm-rib cage must have been a big part of my mistakes. Also
changed grip yday…
good on ya JH.
knowledge should be free.
A small advice for your vids, remember that if you set the audio on
automatic ( meaning you letting the camera set the levels for you, the
levels will look perfect on their meter level scale, but what happens is
that the automatic audio level ‘compresses’ more the audio in result of
picking up a lot more of the background noise)
Best thing is to set audio levels manually around -20 db.
Audio will sound much better and cleaner.
+edoardo barzano I have the settings at -20db now and it is the best of the
settings I have tried to date, the Audio is not high quality recording
equipment although it is the latest Rode Filmmaker kit which is supposed to
be fairly good for the money.
I am not a production guy and I just need something that is easy to set up
and is fairly robust in its construction , the videos are filmed in the
‘Rough’ in the cow paddock most times so they naturally take on the
personality of the environment I guess in that they are ‘Rough’ as well.
They re great videos, and the equipment you have is more than enough.
If you have at at -20 you’ll be fine.
I actually suggested it after watching a video that might have been from
couple of years ago….
I think the video you refered to was an older one with the old audio stuff.
yeah def. Just thought I ll let ya know though. By the way my driver shot
is doing great thx to your tips.